It’s a season of high-velocity politics in Nigeria. But for Christians in Nigeria, it’s more than just politics. It’s about survival, the Christian fa
It’s a season of high-velocity politics in Nigeria. But for Christians in Nigeria, it’s more than just politics. It’s about survival, the Christian faith, the right to believe and worship God the way they choose, the right to live and the right of their children and generations unborn to live in peace. One of the potential threats Christians see from afar in the Muslim-Muslim affront the All-Progressive Alliance APC is forcing down on voters. Church leaders won’t take this in a season of anomie. One of the foremost leaders in Nigeria is Pastor Femi Paul of Grace Assembly, Lagos Nigeria. In this interview with Dr. Bola Adewara, editor E-life, he posits that
… Muslim-Muslim Ticket is a no-no! Tinubu will lose big!
… If he, a Muslim, refused in 2015 to be the vice president of Buhari, why is he not doing the same now?
… Osinbajo did not win because Christians lack sufficient knowledge of how politics is run!
… For Peter Obi to have a good shot at the presidency, the movement has to metamorphose into a political machine which some call structure.
Did it meet you as a surprise that the two frontline parties in Nigeria eventually produced two Muslims as their standard-bearers? What went wrong with the Christian politicians?
To be honest with you. I would have loved to see a different result, but the question makes me ask why they did not make it? I think it is a basic understanding of the difference between reality and idealism. The reality is that… to win in politics, you have to play the politics. You have to understand the politics, but in our case, I think too much has been predicated on what we believe God said to us and not sufficiently on how politics runs. I think it should ordinarily be easy for the Vice President, Osinbajo, to transit to the flag bearer of his party. But it did not happen because, in my opinion, the understanding of the workings of politics was not at play.
We have the APC, PDP, and now, Peter Obi is bringing the Labour Party into recognition. How serious do you think Peter Obi is?
I think Peter Obi is serious. He is a two-term governor who carries the burden of Nigeria. How astute a politician he is, I cannot say, but he has generated a movement that is impressive. I understand by reading and talking to people that there is a difference between a movement and the workings of politics and campaigning. So, it is for Peter Obi to learn how to transit the movement and make it mushroom into campaign machinery that will now help him win.
* Pastor Femi Paul
On social media today, Tinubu is the topic; you can’t ignore him. You either love him fervently or hate him fervently. How did Tinubu get here?
I think is because he has raised people like Tunde Fasola, Prof Osinbajo, and so many others from nowhere, and they went to the top of politics, government and so on. So, people see him as someone who can raise a nobody. Not many people are like that.
Though I think he is now getting it wrong, for instance, the Muslim Muslim Ticket (MMT). When he began to canvass for the MMT, some of us switched off immediately. Let me quote what Tinubu said at the last elections: “I played a significant role in the emergence of President Mohammadu Buhari in 2015. I should have been the vice president, but because of the need to have a Balanced Ticket, I forfeited my position for Yemi Osinbajo”.
According to him, the only reason he did not insist on being the vice president, which would have been Muslim Muslim, was that he thought it didn’t make sense. Because they needed a Balanced Ticket, he forfeited his position for Professor Osinbajo. Why will the same man now go against something that made sense and helped his party win the election this time? That’s why he’s losing out on a massive scale. The Muslim-Muslim Ticket is the height of insensitivity, and what do I mean by that? Insensitivity to the pains of the people, particularly those who have suffered the Islamization agenda, the Fulani supremacist attitude and all that. A lot of people have lost relatives and Mosques have been burnt. There is just so much going on that it is so insensitive for anybody to suggest a Muslim Muslim Ticket. Not now!
A Pastor responded to that position recently that even when it was a Muslim-Christian Ticket, as it is with Buhari-Osinbajo, what did the Christians gained that would be radically different from what could be their lot with Muslim-Muslim Ticket?
I will answer differently: if it was Muslim-Muslim, the complicity of the government and the arm forces in the terrorism and the banditry going on would be worse. Yes, now it is terrible, but it could be worse because there will be no voice in Aso Rock to say, we must slow this down.
Let me give you a quote by Timothy Pinna. “He said the downfall of any nation always comes from the hands of insensitive leaders”.
Sensitivity is being disconnected from people’s pains, sufferings, and fears. Many people fear that the Fulani incursion all over the country will go berserk if we have a Muslim-Muslim Presidency, and that fear is justified. Why would they not factor on that fear when taking a fundamental political position. If you call yourself my leader, you should be sensitive to the people’s well-founded worries and pains.
He is not sensitive also to the fact that the youth are rising up and saying there has to be a balance. MMT is too extreme! The population of Nigeria, at worse, is 50/50, but a lot of us believe that it’s more than 60% Christian, and 40% Muslim. As we have zonal Balance in the APC Presidential candidacy, we should have Religious Balance as well. Insensitivity in leadership is a no-go area!
There is a response that Tinubu is not that much of a fundamental Muslim; he has not converted his wife to a Muslim. He is from the enlightened part of Nigeria, and a Muslim VP is just a figurehead who does nothing. So, we should not be afraid of anything. How do you respond to this?
Why does Peter Obi not fly a Christian-Christian Ticket? What is Tinubu himself going to say about that? It’s as ridiculous to fly a Muslim-Muslim Ticket as it is absurd to fly a Christian-Christian Ticket!
MUSLIM-MUSLIM TICKET: Tinubu has insulted the Church!
– Nigeria National Christian Coalition NNCC
Is the Church really ready for politics?
I think the Church is getting ready because there is a lot of political momentum being generated now. We are seeing that not getting involved in politics is the reason why our prayer lists are so long. The problem that happens out there because of poor governance becomes a prayer point in Church. So, pastors are now saying if we reduce the pain there, there will be less wahala in Church. I feel that the Church is almost ready. It is preparing for governance; at least in the PFN, we now have an effective Directorate of Politics and Governance. Though I cannot say the Church is 100% prepared because the workings of politics are pretty intricate, but we will get there within the next four years.
Please take a look at Christians in politics. At a stage, there were cries that Pastors should not come into politics and that they should remain on their altars. Today we have seen many in politics. Are you satisfied with their performances? Is there a synergy between the Church and the Christians in politics?
I think the Pastors and Christians in politics have done their best; maybe the people’s expectations were too high. The expectations of our people could have been heightened by poverty, insecurity, and the fear of the future, so our people want a sudden saviour. It doesn’t work like that; it has to be progressive. I think they’ve done the best they could. So, more pastors and Christians should go into politics because they have work to do there.
Gradually, the focus of the kidnappers is resting on pastors, and we see how churches dole out to save their preachers? What do you think the Church can do?
I’m not sure there is anything the Church can do. The only thing they can do is try and solve the kidnapping problems from the root. Once you are a person of interest, you are visible and vulnerable to kidnapping. It is more rewarding to kidnap a well-known person than a person who is not. Most pastors don’t go around with a lot of security unlike politicians, top bankers and government officials, that’s why they become easy targets. Concerning Churches paying ransom, they are not paying because they are happy to pay. It’s to salvage the situation while looking for how to solve the kidnapping problem. The kidnapping of men of God and so on is a wake-up call for the Church. It wouldn’t have gotten to this stage if the Church is in politics and governance.
The APC is saying if they don’t pick a Muslim from the North, the party will not win the elections. What they are saying is that there is no Christian in the North that is a vote catcher. How do you respond to this?
That’s because their thinking is one-sided; they want to win the elections at whatever cost! But that’s not the voice of the people. Everybody is entitled to their thinking, but what about the consideration of the people. APC cannot win because what you are saying will literarily obliterate our future and the future of our children. What APC wants cannot be imposed on the people. The people are getting their PVCs, and everybody is standing up. Unless they rig the elections, if even they try, they can’t win it.
The Church has mobilized. In Lagos alone, we now have an idea of the population of the Church. It’s in the region of 6,000,000, and 70% of our people are prepared to vote this time. How many votes got Sanwo-Olu in? It’s not around 500,000. If 3,000,000 Christians vote for one person, there is no way he would lose. If they know what is good for them, they know that they cannot superimpose MMT. People are resisting them, starting with me!
Let us look at the larger picture of the northern Muslims’ attitude to Christians, the killings, persecutions and insensitivities. How can we attenuate this bitterness, so that brotherhood and confidence can reign? Can we ever get to that level with the northern Muslims?
That’s a tough one. You know, experience shapes a human being’s psychology. It shapes people’s thinking, attitude and responses. Until the experience the Christians have with the Muslims improves, it’s difficult to change their perceptions or responses. A child that is always beaten will always respond with fear when you call him. If the beating stops, over some time, the child becomes calm. A positive change in the environment could cause Christians to become less apprehensive. I feel that what we should expect is a change in modules, it can’t happen suddenly. That’s why the Muslim Muslim Ticket will not fly. It’s a NO NO. It is not going to happen.
* Pastor Femi Paul
Is it possible for the Christians to engage the northern Muslims, telling them that we don’t hate them, we are not against them?
I don’t think they feel we hate them because our religion preaches love. They know we don’t hate them, but they believe that we are docile, and most of them are aggressive and keep coming for us. Now, a great man of God has said everybody should arm himself. So, if you don’t respect the fact that I’m entitled to believe what I want, I will let you know that you can’t come into my space – It has gone that far now.
But actually, the answer is within the Islamic people themselves. I know a lot of nice Muslims who are educated and don’t believe in violence. If such Muslims speak more to the extremists, it will work because it’s easier to change something from within. I have a Muslim friend; we are excellent friends because he is not an extremist. So, it is such people who should talk to their people, saying, it’s not like this, where are you getting these things from?
Lastly, are the Christians Association of Nigeria and the Pentecostal Fellowship of Nigeria handling the politics rightly?
I think the pain and our experiences have woken everybody up. Credit has to be given here to the PFN Directorate for Politics and Governance. And I like the fact that we are not speaking hate. We were talking about change. What we have suffered ordinarily should make us counter-aggressive, but our faith is so strong that we were saying no to hate, and so we demand change and change doesn’t mean that the Muslims have to be reduced. It just means that we must change how we deal with things so that everybody (both Christians and Muslims) can have a decent life. I think a lot is happening, we are not perfect, but we are making great progress.
What message do you have for the Nigerian youths, many of whom are seen to be siding with Peter Obi?
Peter Obi’s movement is very welcomed. There is an awareness, people are asking questions and making demands, but it could fizzle out after the elections and then we have to jump-start it again.
It is essential to harness it and let it be something that continues after the elections, to be the voice of the people, provoking balance to everything and holding politicians and the government accountable. But for a Peter Obi to have a good shot at the Presidency, the ‘Obedient Movement’ has to metamorphose into a political and campaign machine. And it’s important because our youths drive it. So, it is a good movement. They are not violent, and there is no class segmentation, it doesn’t matter whether you are rich or poor. And that’s what Nigeria needs so that we eradicate the segmentation of a superrich and the super poor. I like that movement, but it needs direction. I want everybody to encourage them and set a balance. It’s not just a Peter Obi thing; Peter Obi is provoking it. I hope it doesn’t peter out with his political ambition.
I can see your passion for Nigeria, but this passion is dwindling outside there. Do you think this country can survive?
The truth is, if there is no restructuring, Nigeria will split up. It’s worrisome because the Labour Party doesn’t have much political machinery. It is said that the party doesn’t have any sit in the parliament, whether in the Senate or the House of Rep; and so Peter Obi may end up being a lone ranger. To that extent, it looks worrisome. Though, if it is as a matter of will, he has the will. But will he find the right people to work with in the elected offices? That’s another thing; at least with Peter Obi, it’s a good start. You see, we are starting from somewhere, and Restructuring is not negotiable. If we don’t restructure, I don’t think Nigeria cannot last.
The primary opponent of restructuring is the North. Why do you think they hate to hear that word?
The North is afraid because they are the ones benefiting from the imbalance. Someone like Pastor Ladi Thompson, that went to school at Ahmadu Bello University will tell you that from time, those people have been living large on the union of Nigeria. It pays them that Nigeria remains like this. That’s why they don’t want to restructure. What is wrong with restructuring? Every state will run itself, have its police, and manage its resources. Everybody has resources.
God loves Nigeria. Let me speak as a man of God – Nigeria is important to God; Nigeria is a Centre of Evangelism worldwide. We are sending out the gospel more than any country in the world, and God is watching over the source of the light coming from Nigeria. Nigeria will be fine, but it doesn’t have to take long.
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